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Gearbox (Linkage) Page |
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My Vehicle: |
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A 1991 Talbot Express, Model 1300p, 2.0 Petrol, 5-speed Gearbox, Coachbuilt Motorhome body (Autosleeper Talisman GL with monocoque fibreglass coach built body as shown opposite) Owned since 2005. |
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Introduction: |
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Having read a lot about these vehicles over the years much of which is ill-informed or just plain daft. In particular there is a lot of concern in relation to the gearbox, so with 25 years as a practical hands-on mechanic I decided to record a few comments of my own experiences in the hope that it will allow owners / potential owners to enjoy their vehicles more. My current Vehicle is a 1991 Autosleeper Talisman GL based on the 1300p (2.0 Litre Petrol engined) Talbot Express which I have owned since March 2005 and is my second camper, the first being an Autosleeper based on the venerable Bedford CF. The Talbot Express base vehicle is known as a “Sevel” type manufactured in Perhaps most importantly it is worth noting that no amount of
fiddling with the
gear linkage is going to correct a worn synchromesh, and no
amount of special Oils / additives is going to alleviate imprecise selection
issues caused by worn gear lever mechanism/bushes. When performing gear changes be gentle but firm. This is a
relatively old commercial vehicle design so the gear change should not be
rushed and it will not be as “silky smooth” as your average car. |
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GEAR LINKAGE |
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The Talbot Express is a
Peugeot J5 in Right hand drive form. The Gearbox was designed for Left Hand
drive using a column
change (mounted just below the steering wheel) on the Left Hand side of the
vehicle which entered directly into the top of the gearbox. To accommodate a
floor change for RH drive vehicles a rather complex mechanism of levers and
joints was implemented. It is this mechanism and a basic design flaw that is responsible for wear which results in a “sloppy” imprecise gear selection,
and even banging your hands on the dashboard in extreme cases. It should be noted however that there are other factors that can contribute to this
imprecise gear selection,
most notably the engine mounts which can allow the engine/gearbox to move
around a considerable amount.
Other issues with the box relate to using the correct oil, oil
level modifications and problems with water ingress. |
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Earlier Style Gear linkage
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My comments relate to the later linkage shown on the right, however many of the same issues will apply to the earlier version, especially the most noticeable wear point. There are however numerous places for free play to exist so do not be too hasty to diagnose a specific bush.
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One
of the most significant areas for free play is where the shaft enters the top of the
gearbox (shown opposite and in the larger picture below).
Here the metal collar (bush) wears over time and free play is controlled by nothing more than a Rubber O-ring housed in the collar. Even minor free play here translates to considerable movement at the gearlever and this is the most frequent (sometimes the only) problem that needs to be sorted. Provided the metal collar/bush is not too badly worn simply replacing the o-ring can make a considerable difference. Check the shaft for sideways movement to see if it is worn. There should be only a tiny amount of free play. Unfortunately the original O-Ring is no longer available new, however, an aftermarket upgrade version is available on EBay for approx £5 inc postage and many users have reported considerable improvement replacing this. I've run one of these for 14k miles before pulling it out to check wear and there was virtually none. If your metal collar/bush is badly worn then the only option is to buy another. Delphin Designs advertise an "improved" item with tighter tollerances so this may be the prefered option athough at £40 plus postage it is not cheap.
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OIL: |
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At only 33,000 miles but 14 years of use I decided to change the gearbox oil as preventative maintenance. Initially I tried 2 litres of standard 80w90 oil but this gave very poor results. It was noticeably difficult to engage 1st or 2nd when cold and even “notchy” on the other gears. After only one short journey I drained the oil and refilled with Semi-Synthetic 75w90 which gave much improved performance.
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OIL LEVEL |
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Apparently there were a lot of failures on these Gearboxes due
to the 5th gear not being properly lubricated. To overcome this the G/box oil level was steadily increased until by the
end of production it was set at approximately 20mm down from the top. I have
modified my gearbox/final drive dipstick accordingly (picture opposite).
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I have run my vehicle for 10,000+ miles with this revised oil level and there is no oil loss through the breather (although even if there was it would not be a serious issue), nor is oil being forced passed the drive shaft seals or speedometer cable entry point. For those that don’t know, the dipstick is accessible at the rear of the G/box by (a) reaching through the NS wheel arch (b) Removing the spare wheel and getting to if from under the bonnet, or (c) raise the vehicle all round and get at it from underneath (my preferred method). |
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OIL FILLING and BREATHER |
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It is advisable to fill with oil via the Reversing light switch.
The official manual goes further and states that you MUST fill through the
reversing light switch and NOT through the dipstick hole.
The reason is that the Gearbox and Differential casings are
separated by a high barrier (oil baffle) so one side fills before the other.
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The dipstick goes in via the back of the differential casing, so if you fill through this (rear) hole and the vehicle was not level it might conceivably be possible to fill the differential casing without getting sufficient oil in the gearbox. I always fill mine through the reversing light switch (which goes
straight into the gearbox) to be safe
although personally I think this warning refers to a time when the gearbox
levels were considerably lower, i.e. the earlier models. If you follow the dipstick
modification above the level is presumably higher than the dividing
baffle so it would be very difficult to under fill the box. |
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If you’re thinking “why don’t I just block the breather” then
don’t as it is there to release the pressure inside the gearbox/final drive
caused by the oil expanding as the temperature rises. If you block the
breather the gearbox
internal pressure will increase and you risk blowing oil past the drive shaft
seals. This would not only be very messy but could eventually lead to a
seriously low oil level going unnoticed. It might also warrant replacement of
the Driveshaft oil seals and this is something to avoid as removal of the
inner drive shafts where they enter the differential can lead to serious damage of the shaft and gearbox casing if
not done with care. Basically don’t block the breather! Modification: In 2006 I replaced my Gearbox breather with a long tube as shown in the photo above. This tube is a tight fit into the top of the gearbox (held in place with loctite) and routed up-forward and down. This allows the Gearbox to breath without any possibility of water entering it. After 10k+ miles like this I can report no problems with oil loss. |
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ENGINE MOUNTS |
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What have these got to do with Gear selection you might ask?
Unfortunately quite a bit in some cases. More importantly in my opinion the
Engine mounts can also be a contributory factor in snapped
exhaust manifold studs in the cylinder head which requires tricky and/or expensive repairs.
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Problem |
Symptoms / Result |
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Worn Rear Mount allowing
the engine / gearbox to rock front-rear when driving |
Overstressed exhaust system
resulting in fractured pipes and snapped exhaust manifold bolts (expensive to
put right). Can result in clutch judder when pulling away. May manifest
itself as a squeak from the exhaust pipe flange (where it connects to the
manifold) although over-tightening the exhaust flange will prevent this
(which is NOT a good idea as better to have a squeaking exhaust than snapped
manifold studs). |
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Worn Side mounts (there are
2, one on each side) allowing the engine /gearbox to move sideways on corners |
This makes finding gears on
corners somewhat difficult, and can contribute to clutch judder. If you
cannot reach 2nd whilst pulling away on a left hand corner then
this is probably the cause (this particular issue can be overcome by
lengthening the appropriate linkage 1 turn at a time.). |
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From 1991 (I need to check this) the Talbot Express used a larger and much stronger rear engine mount. Despite having the larger mount (85mm) on my van it was badly worn after only 35k miles (see picture opposite). A genuine replacement form Peugeot cost £48 and is noticeably more “chunky” than the original. It is certainly worth the money. If you have a pre-91 vehicle check if it has the larger engine mount and if not it may be worthwhile obtaining the larger bracket for the body (from a scrap yard) and then purchasing a new Post-91 rear mounting. |
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I believe the 2 side engine mounts
were also approximately £50
each in 2006 but I don't have current prices or availability for these.
However the side mounts are far less of an issue and merely contribute to changeable
gear selection on corners / rough ground. If money is tight its probably not worth changing these until they cause
noticeable problems.
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For a sloppy Gear change: Get underneath the vehicle and begin grabbing each part of the linkage in turn check for free play. The most common and easily the most effective is checking the vertical rod that enters the top of the gearbox. I have subsequently seen vans where the O-Ring was so badly worn that the shaft was literally flopping about and almost all the freeplay in the gearchange was attributable to this. The good thing is it can easily and cheaply be cured by replacing this with a new and slightly uprated O-Ring. Even with a badly worn collar/bush this will work. If you collar/bush is very badly worn it may be advisable to go for a new one at £40+, however it is probably worth trying the O-ring first. I was so impressed with the O-rings that I now sell these myself and have a great many satisfied customers. If you have wear in the other sockets / joints it is not so easy to fix, and considerably more expensive. See the list of linkages above. Since changing the above O-Ring I have also added
(for
“fun’ as they were relatively cheap and not actually worn!):
My gear
linkage is completely standard (apart from the oversized O-Ring) and near perfect. Difficulty Engaging Gears: Assuming it is not a linkage nor clutch adjustment issue then you are looking at either the wrong Oil or a mechanical (i.e. synchromesh) issue inside the box itself.
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Finally .... |
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I hope you find these pages Useful. If you have anything to add please feel free to email me, however I regret that I have a day-job and do not have time to provide detailed technical assistance. If you are looking for advice and assistance you could do worse than the PreLoved Forum (www.preloved.co.uk) which has lots of Talbot Express threads. However as with any forum (or indeed any source of information including suppliers) don't take everything at face-value. Do your own research, buy the manuals and if in doubt entrust the work to a competent mechanic. |
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